Why Do We Just Kill It at the Source to End Our Problems?

[That Guy in a Box]

Why is it that certain things in the game are hard to impossible to get? It makes no sense. I do not understand why we must eliminate all of our problems by killing it off when it's not the items or such that is the problem, it's the people using them. I hate it whenever I see maybe a thread wondering about things like guns, most admins/players respond they can't do this because of misuse/minges. And that, is a bullshit reason.

I don't think people understand that we HAVE ADMINS FOR DEALING WITH PEOPLE THAT DO NOT FOLLOW THE RULES. But, instead, we just decide that it's an even better decision to take things and make them HARD AS SHIT to get, such as guns. There is no reason why we are not able to do certain things because people did not follow the rules. THEY should be punished for their actions, not us. I even remember someone saying that it'd be too hard for people to smuggle in weapons like that ICly. Then, why do we have an active population in the Outlands? Because it's easier to smuggle people then guns? No, it's not. Why do we have OTHER contraband in the City then? Is it easier to smuggle Stationary Radios? No.

This also brings me up to when Purple had that small group of Traders that sold weapons and ammunition to the public, and it was great! Though, it was short-lived due to some other admins getting pissed when on occasion there were people not using them right, or people got mugged etc... Once again; ADMINS, WE SHOULD USE THEM.

I also don't have a clue why we're not allowed to freely go to the City from the Outlands. I remember hearing that people were running rampant with guns from OL. That makes just about the same amount of sense then Charlie Sheen is completely durg-free. If you got a gun in OL, chances are you're not a minge since it's one of the hardest things to do now.

We should AT THE LEAST be allowed to apply for some sort of auth to obtain them in both OL and the City. In that way, we can at least know that the people who've been accepted are the level of RPers that are fit to having a weapon and not abusing it. So what that we can have a IC knife, or maybe a stick? That's not gonna help against a mob of OTA flailing their weapons around. It MAYBE able to handle some un-armed people that're trying to mug you.

And I don't even know why it's EVEN HARDER to get a Resistance Uniform? You can't even abuse that, and it's one of the only clothes that you can get as a Citizen? So why is it so hard? I often hear people saying 'You don't need uniforms to Resistance RP.', but what if we wanted to? We are usually left with these neat-like uniforms, what if I wanted a more rugged look to myself? There's no good reason why we can't have them?

I understand that this is probably gonna just piss people off, and this is a sort of repetitive theme to a post, and it's somewhat short. I just wanted to make a couple points of opinion across.

[GamingZealot]

The reason its harder to get guns (to my knoledge) is that during and post war, the CCA thouroughly sweeped through the world and either collected or destroyed more or less all the weapons. This is why  there is only the MP7, 9mm, and SPAS-12 and such. This means asside from a few exceptions the only guns you would be getting would be from dead Union members or ones they lost which would be few indeed. As for smuggling from outlands to city, ICly you have to pass through a OTA bunkey/headquarters to get to outlands. The base is more to keep outland members out than to keep city people in is what I am guessing, that's why its so hard to get an outlands person back to city ICly. As for the radios being more available the explanation would be that while the Union did destroy all that technology that got in their way, I imagine more of it slipped through their fingers as it wasn't as large of a threat, being level two and three contraband. Finally, if you are looking for an SMG or pistol to defend yourself from OTA on the city, that's not going to help you. In the outlands you can hide from OTA and should, in the city the entire point is be careful and don't get OTA involved, it is designed so you won't win.

[swag master spiderman]

Guns aren't given out in the city because nearly everytime they are, and literally almost every time something bad has happened that you wouldn't really expect to happen.

For vests it's because normally people wearing them think they're better than other people and they're just really bad for RP.

These questions have been answered time and time again and the answer is still the same. I doubt doing it again will change it, sorry.

[That Guy in a Box]

Guns aren't given out in the city because nearly everytime they are, and literally almost every time something bad has happened that you wouldn't really expect to happen.

For vests it's because normally people wearing them think they're better than other people and they're just really bad for RP.

These questions have been answered time and time again and the answer is still the same. I doubt doing it again will change it, sorry.

Didn't I JUST say that when people abuse things, we have Admins for that?

Also, so what if we have people acting elitist? We have PLENTY of that with other factions, such as the CCA. Why don't we kill that off too then?

The reason its harder to get guns (to my knoledge) is that during and post war, the CCA thouroughly sweeped through the world and either collected or destroyed more or less all the weapons.

Then, why is it that in the actual game of Hl2, there were fully armed Refugees along the Canals? Are they magic? Hell, I even remember screwing around on that one Apartment map in HL2, and as the CCA member were busting in that one of the apartments I noticed a 'Citizen (Pistol symbol) Metrocop' in the right corner? Are they Wizzards that can magically have these 'few' weapons? And I do so recall the CCA not being implemented until AFTER the Seven Hour War.             

[swag master spiderman]

CCA are elitist because they are supposed to be, resistance aren't.

You don't need the vest to RP, want it that much? Donate for it.

When nearly every time guns are distributed they get abused, I think it's out of the hands of admins. They can't stop it 24/7.

[GamingZealot]

Then, why is it that in the actual game of Hl2, there were fully armed Refugees along the Canals? Are they magic? Hell, I even remember screwing around on that one Apartment map in HL2, and as the CCA member were busting in that one of the apartments I noticed a 'Citizen (Pistol symbol) Metrocop' in the right corner? Are they Wizzards that can magically have these 'few' weapons? And I do so recall the CCA not being implemented until AFTER the Seven Hour War.             

There were fully armed Refugees along the Canals because there ARE guns, just few. Think about the ratio of how many armed civilians you see to Mertro Police. In HL2 (not counting episodes when the Union has been mostly over-run) you see what, like maybe 10 armed civilians before you more or less destroy the Union? And you are playing as Gordon Freeman, moving through areas so far out of city and remote. Not sure what you mean by "a 'Citizen (Pistol symbol) Metrocop' " And yes, I meant Union not CCA, sorry for the mistake.

[Dallas]

We really don't need guns to resistance RP.

You argue that we have admins to control guns. With our number of admins, that isn't possible if EVERYONE could access weapons, the admins would have to be working flat out. They would get no RP done and the server would be ultimately ruined by guns.

[That Guy in a Box]

I never said it was for Resistance RP, nor was I implying we needed that.
Also said that we have Admins for dealing with misuse, and I never implied everyone having guns. I was trying to say how it is not appropriate that it's near impossible to obtain certain things due to people messing up.
You act as if EVERYONE not in the CCA would abuse the weapons, which is untrue. People in OL have guns, we don't abuse them. Again, CCA, you've got guns, that doesn't ruin RP. By the fact, 'we' feel it betters ours, so why does it not Resistance RP?

Also, if you've ever played single-player G-mod, you'd know that when a NPC dies it says '*NPC NAME* *SYMBOL IN WHICH SIGNIFIES WHAT WEAPON WAS USED* *DEAD NPC*. I was more or less adding something in that didn't even need, so, yeah. I'm also sorry to say that I can count much more then Ten on my way. Counting the dead ones that used to be there, there might've been a size able amount. But, you're almost counter acting your own post by saying they had these 'few' guns, because if they were so few, and were so thoroughly searched for, why are they in the hands of the Refugees?

[alaskan thunderfuck]

Guns aren't needed to roleplay and generally only add unneeded drama. Sure, admins can handle shit like this but why waste the time in the first place?

[That Guy in a Box]

I think I'm going to stop with the replys here. It's getting kind of tiresome to counter-point everyone's close-minded reply.
This post is NOT about guns. It's about the inappropriateness of how we deal with our problems that seem expendable to some, in which are not. We take the laziest way out by killing off the good and bad so that way we don't have to deal with the bad, and I find that the most aggravating thing about how we have this community. No, not the frustrating biases that make no sense, not the lack of RP in general. The way we lazily deal with our problems that are Citizen related                       

Guns aren't needed to roleplay and generally only add unneeded drama. Sure, admins can handle shit like this but why waste the time in the first place?

Perfect example of why I'm making this post.

[The Doctor, RIP Juggernaut]

He is kinda right about outlands, we don't have a massive minge problem and if even if they get firearms they won't have enough ammo to cause really any drama before they run out or get put down by a admin/good player. Most of the drama that gets caused by the guns(Mugging, bitching about not having any, shit like that) can be dealt with ICly by players forming groups to survive(Which is what we want.), and groups that deals with muggers and removing that kind of problem.

Another big point that OP may have forgot about are the zombie events, currently we get quite a few from OTA dropping shells or just normal events. That's good and all and it creates fear RP, but when it comes time to mop them up its rather we need an admin, vort, or a well armed player to take care of them.
I think it would be better if we let little weapons and ammo(Say pistol and 9mm ammo) be a bit more common due to the fact that they can't kill OTA with them icly, it helps citizens to be able to defend them self's from head crabs and that while running to a group to hide/be defended by. But it doesn't allow any major RDMing spree and any mugging can easily be dealt with by the better armed resistance fighters.

All in all should we allow more minor weapons like pistols and the rare SMG? I think so. Should everyone be allowed a combine sniper or a .357 magnum or an AR2? No, only the people who PROVE that they can properly RP with these guns should be allowed to have access to them.

In reality, no you don't need guns to RP. But guns add things that we could use to RP with.(Crime gangs, muggers and such) and give us more RP to deal with then what it currently is(Which is RP with crazy people who have knifes, or hide from OTA while dealing with IC drama).

And another thing is it cuts the gap from new players and the all out hardcore resistance fighters and gives some room for them to prove them selves and not have to rely on said people to watch over them every second of the day(Which can be good, but we want more groups to be forming not just the two or three we currently have).

Right now even if they did find a gun, ammo(Which should be more common then the gun its self) is almost rarer then a combine sniper, when ammo is being made by the combine in bulk, and it does get captured/easily lost compared to a firearm.

[Hazard Time]

I hate to jump on the bandwagon here, but when OL first came out, guns were just lying all over the place.  Admins had to institute the Un-Outlandify Characters Applications because people were getting guns in OL, going back to the city and mugging people.  It happened to me.  Two guys with guns went through the apartments and mugged/killed everyone they met as if they were playing DarkRP.  Every time guns have flowed freely, mass RDM has happened.  It was happening often enough to where Oz had no choice but wipe all non-CCA issued weapons, pissing off MANY respectable RPers in the process.

In short, there is a reason weapons are harder to find than a g-spot.  These are not isolated incidents we are dealing with, and until a better alternative is found, we will all have to deal with filing applications for everything but basic privileges.

[The Doctor, RIP Juggernaut]

First, its impossible now for someone to take weapons from outlands and go on the city with out a VERY VERY good reason.

Second, Oz wiped all the weapons because minges and /UNITS/ where stealing from the armory and giving them out/giving it to the other characters/friends.

The reasons you posted were for the city, we can deal with mugging Icly and if it gets really bad, remove the person causing all the bullshit.
Other then that your reasons have already been fixed in ways that would allow weapons to be more common on outlands then your "g-spot" theory

[Hazard Time]

You are correct.  I forgot to mention that units were at fault here.  I stand with Roven/Atticat/Toxillium/whoever-thinks-this-server-needs-to-be-unfucked in that we need to close CCA apps.  I've seen it done before, and it would kill two birds with one stone:  CCA no longer gets shit units, and the server doesn't get dominated by CCA.  Also, the reason why I brought up past events was because it is well known that those who forget the past tend to repeat it.  That Guy in the Box, while I respect him very much, doesn't know much about this server's history to know why we are as fucked up as we are.

[That Guy in a Box]

Meh, I said I wouldn't reply but I guess I will...
I... actually do know plenty about CG's past enough to know why certain things are (except I still don't know the story of the Resistance Uniform). But we cannot let the past dictate the present and the future. We must learn from our mistakes, and attempt at different solutions instead of fearing it in all.
I'm at least happy SOME people get it.