High Command RP Ramble

[smt]

It probably wasn't "necessary", but it happened so why can't we keep it IC? And even if we have to void that part for some reason, the entire event doesn't deserve to be voided.

[Doctor Nice roButt]

...made me strongly go against the whole thing. You two claimed it was meta due to the fact the guy who reported you was down on the other side of the sewer and couldn't see you. I brought up the fact that the citizen would of easily been able to seen your optics in the (dark according to a reason he can't see you two) and you admitted to it and deemed it as a reasonable point, along with a few others that me and the other units came up with. But after that, you then proceeded to still claim meta and which lead to you guys just voiding the whole report. It seemed as if you weren't even listening to the points we were bringing up, yet you admitted to them being reasonable and valid. You just wanted to save your characters/RP.

It turned out it was meta'd. There was no rp and a request device was lol spawned to report it.
There's a difference between trying to save my character and accepting valid rp.

. Everything took second place to your RP. The three or four inactive weeks airborne wasn't on city (Not complaining about it because he is S0 so he doesn't have much to do and there are other games and gamemodes other than just city. Just bringing it up for the point ->) caused a build up of projects requests and units who needed to speak to him. But the one moment we had the chance,  we get shut down because of the cyber or what ever you want to call it that you two were doing. And, considering that he most likely isn't going to be on for awhile after this, it just adds to it.

Everything took "second place" to our rp because it was the current rp going on. He couldn't be like "I'm going to get you out", walk five feet, then go off and help a unit because they requested him. RP is RP. Perhaps afterwards, if the shit sort, hadn't happened, he would have been more than happy to help you guys, but he was busy letting my character go. You complaining about not being able to have first priority is an ooc problem, not an ic. Also, we weren't cybering, thanks.

[Lone Wanderer <??"?]

I agree with Smt and Sexy. The roleplay should have simply been allowed to happen. Realistically, very few members of the CCA would have joined up in the first place off of the Union's values and mission. They either joined for food, safety, or power over others in a time of unfamiliarity. As a person ranks up through the CCA, they obviously are exposed more and more to the Union's ideals, but aside from direct brainwashing, you can't really dramatically change a person's values. So, unless 938 had an undieing loyalty to the Union at some point, it's completely possible that he might do something for his own benefit. Afterall, it's highly likely that joining the CCA in the first place was for his own benefit, along with many other units in the force.

As for voiding portions of RP. Why does this happen? It's supposed to be realistic, and as far as I know, you can't void real life. Everytime something happens that people don't like/agree with, it doesn't need to get voided right away. Sometimes, shit happens that you don't like. If you have a problem with this, take it from an IC approach if you're able to. If not, suck it up and deal with it. It's /extremely/ frustrating when people constantly argue/complain about stuff like this. There's far to much OOC involvement in roleplay that goes on, and you're destroying immersion by dragging out these issues in OOC.

[Mr. Pettit]

What I mean by 938 going rogue isn't him just straight out going behind the Union's back and leaving. I mean he committed an anti-Union act. He assisted an anti-citizen which is a pretty big decision that can result in ultimately fucking up your character's life literally. And if it was out of sympathy, that's a pretty big step just for being sympathetic. The furthest I've attempted on 495 along the lines of sympathy is giving someone a warning instead of beating them. But what he did was commit a rogue act, and should be treated that way. So if we did catch 938 and apparently everything up to the point of us confronting him with Elizabeth after all the confusion, we were called out for metagame because the citizen who called it in was  too far away and spawned a request device to call it in. (I think) So then there's the IC perspective you can put into account. I would think at least ICly that there's cameras installed in the various areas of the nexus. So all of the rp that was going on inside the medbay was recorded and logged. Or if 938 deleted that, It's going to be detected.
But that's debatable. It was brought up by other admins but I honestly don't care at this point if It's voided or not. Eventually 938 would be caught and amputated for that and Elizabeth would be executed. Oh well.

Everything took "second place" to our rp because it was the current rp going on. He couldn't be like "I'm going to get you out", walk five feet, then go off and help a unit because they requested him. RP is RP. Perhaps afterwards, if the shit sort, hadn't happened, he would have been more than happy to help you guys, but he was busy letting my character go. You complaining about not being able to have first priority is an ooc problem, not an ic. Also, we weren't cybering, thanks.

And I can agree with twinkletoes by this, as he pulled my comment as an example. Airborne was very busy with what I can only assume was his new job. Real life comes first, yes. But then when he does have time to come on and there's a truckload of backed up shit including projects like the vests I had been working on for days, and he's doing something that at the time was so god damn stupid I couldn't believe it everyone there including myself didn't know what to think. We take the time to rp developing our projects just so 938 can say "go ahead" over the radio to give you a gun and let you go. That is what he means. High command is very minimal work. You set up a frame, say yes or no to questions while trying to keep the peace by being tough. Which doesn't essentially mean you need to be pissed off 24/7. I argued about HC's process of dealing with situations a while back. What I saw was a bigass moodswing when you hit OfC/DvL. 270 was a prime example of "ripping spines" when anyone spoke. I hated that, so when I got to AmU, then OfC and eventually DvL/Section OfC I kept a laid back, calm and calculated shell around my unit. Inside he's scared of screwing up and still learning himself; Most of the Units he leads are years older than he is.
That's what I mean by the way you roleplay as high command. Breaking the UU's rules or abiding by them isn't your only two choices.

[Sexy Frog]

What I mean by 938 going rogue isn't him just straight out going behind the Union's back and leaving. I mean he committed an anti-Union act. He assisted an anti-citizen which is a pretty big decision that can result in ultimately fucking up your character's life literally. And if it was out of sympathy, that's a pretty big step just for being sympathetic. The furthest I've attempted on 495 along the lines of sympathy is giving someone a warning instead of beating them. But what he did was commit a rogue act, and should be treated that way. So if we did catch 938 and apparently everything up to the point of us confronting him with Elizabeth after all the confusion, we were called out for metagame because the citizen who called it in was  too far away and spawned a request device to call it in. (I think) So then there's the IC perspective you can put into account. I would think at least ICly that there's cameras installed in the various areas of the nexus. So all of the rp that was going on inside the medbay was recorded and logged. Or if 938 deleted that, It's going to be detected.
But that's debatable. It was brought up by other admins but I honestly don't care at this point if It's voided or not. Eventually 938 would be caught and amputated for that and Elizabeth would be executed. Oh well.

To be entirely honest, seeing as if the request was mostly metagame as claimed, then nobody has any reason to question Airborne. There would be no IC reasoning for checking the footage for anything because as far as anyone knows, Elizabeth is dead. Her file would read DECEASED. If he deleted the footage, it would be before you placed your system in place which in all honest was likely pushed in response to what has happened due to this fiasco. So in a sense, had this stuff not happened, the 'file recovery' system would not have been put in place. That on its own comes off as meta, however I am not about to point fingers here. That is a topic for another time.

Regardless, there would be no reason for the files in question to be even sought after as all anyone saw was Airborne wheeling out a corpse covered in a bloody tarp. But again, like any action anyone does, there are always repercussions. Batman is going to be caught at some point. That is a fact. Airborne may very well be found out at some point if he starts slipping. That's a fact.

As far as I'm concerned, this whole voiding business is on the basis of shotty evidence that is high controversial. People claim DNA, people claim cameras, people claim metagame, people claim supposed witnesses, people claim augments/brainwashing, people claim weapon logging for the missing pistol (which is total bull shit), people claim this and that. I think if you all /are/ going to push for this, try to get something a bit more concrete.

Edit: Not only that but being at S0, in a realistic mindset, what is to stop him from just shooting the person who doubts him or holds allegations against him in the face? Units are easily replaceable and if the Section Leader of that section feels one of his units is disposable for one reason or another, he can de-service units at his leisure. The only reason that is not in place is because of OOC reasons of it not being fair. So if you want to go ahead and call realism, there's some realism for you.

> I am high ranking unit in "heartless, emotionless" CCA.
> I do something bad. Unit's are accusing me.
> Unit is lower rank.
> Kill unit for insubordination or make up reason of unit being unfit for task.
> Freedom

[Mr. Pettit]

Edited my other post. And yes, the footage, logs etc. (especially the pistol's serial) are not good reasons to investigate when as of now there is not reason to and would be flat out meta. But if he does in fact start slipping IC, S2 or others could investigate. When or if that does happen a lot of those examples will be rendered helpful and proving 938 did help Elizabeth escape. And if he's going to deservice units and let an AC escape after he's just amputated someone he probably worked with ICly for a long, long time.. It doesn't make sense at as both kind of conflict with each other at least how he thinks. He doesn't have to kill them either. He can show sympathy as he did in that giant example with Elizabeth. But idk, I'm not Airborne nor do I play 938.

[Sexy Frog]

Edited my other post. And yes, the footage, logs etc. (especially the pistol's serial) are not good reasons to investigate when as of now there is not reason to and would be flat out meta. But if he does in fact start slipping IC, S2 or others could investigate. When or if that does happen a lot of those examples will be rendered helpful and proving 938 did help Elizabeth escape. And if he's going to deservice units and let an AC escape after he's just amputated someone he probably worked with ICly for a long, long time.. It doesn't make sense at as both kind of conflict with each other at least how he thinks. He doesn't have to kill them either. He can show sympathy as he did in that giant example with Elizabeth. But idk, I'm not Airborne nor do I play 938.

From what I've heard, Airborne has a long history of shooting units for the lols. He patches them up after, but he still does. So it's not that hard to pull off.

"I shot the unit to teach him a lesson. I accidentally aimed too high and shot him in the heart." Problem solved.

[The Doctor, RIP Juggernaut]

I /may/ be a little lost here but, unless you have a reason to check the footage/check for the weapons serial(Which is bullshit because not even the best CCA unit RPs that bullcrap anyway, and keeping track of a database of every firearm the CCA has would be massive, plus it would most likely get passed off as a training pistol/extra sidearm.) then unless you get a reason for them to be checked, then you can't really use it, and depending on how its done the footage may show nothing, you can't have cameras covering every angle at every moment in every room, the wiring would be impossible, not to mention you have to allow for /oversight/. As for DNA and all that, unless it was RPed THEN AND THERE, it shouldn't be a factor.

Personally I think what Airborne did was a good thing, it makes for character development and it shows that the CCA isn't all "LOL WE'RE UBER BADASSES THAT S2K EVER LUL REBEL ON SIGHT!" like most people think.
Perhaps ya'll should realize that we throw canon out a lot to make for better RP, but when people start bitching that are either high ranking CCA or a large group of people, everyone seems to forget that.

The union(And their forces) aren't perfect, stop assuming that they are; and maybe allow for a /little/ roleplay? I remember being bored as fuck as high command and I was the leader of the most interesting division at the time.

I personally think(From a civilian perspective) that it should be allowed to RP out to the very end.

[raged]

i'm confused as to why it's supposed to be voided - IC should remain IC without OOC interference unless server rules were broke. if airbourne was caught/seen allowing elizabeth to escape (which supposedly was metagame as i was contacted IC'ly about it on 621) then that should be the factor that sees as to how the event plays out, not people whining about it ooc'ly

and someone explain whether he was seen or not thx

[Mr. Pettit]

Edited my other post. And yes, the footage, logs etc. (especially the pistol's serial) are not good reasons to investigate when as of now there is not reason to and would be flat out meta. But if he does in fact start slipping IC, S2 or others could investigate. When or if that does happen a lot of those examples will be rendered helpful and proving 938 did help Elizabeth escape. And if he's going to deservice units and let an AC escape after he's just amputated someone he probably worked with ICly for a long, long time.. It doesn't make sense at as both kind of conflict with each other at least how he thinks. He doesn't have to kill them either. He can show sympathy as he did in that giant example with Elizabeth. But idk, I'm not Airborne nor do I play 938.

From what I've heard, Airborne has a long history of shooting units for the lols. He patches them up after, but he still does. So it's not that hard to pull off.

"I shot the unit to teach him a lesson. I accidentally aimed too high and shot him in the heart." Problem solved.

Normally he shoots them in the feet or non-fatal areas. Most of support knows that, and I'm sure they all have been shot. But they seem to respect him for that and are aware of that. Anyone can shoot a person to stop them if they know almost 100 percent they wont die.

[smt]

Edited my other post. And yes, the footage, logs etc. (especially the pistol's serial) are not good reasons to investigate when as of now there is not reason to and would be flat out meta. But if he does in fact start slipping IC, S2 or others could investigate. When or if that does happen a lot of those examples will be rendered helpful and proving 938 did help Elizabeth escape. And if he's going to deservice units and let an AC escape after he's just amputated someone he probably worked with ICly for a long, long time.. It doesn't make sense at as both kind of conflict with each other at least how he thinks. He doesn't have to kill them either. He can show sympathy as he did in that giant example with Elizabeth. But idk, I'm not Airborne nor do I play 938.

From what I've heard, Airborne has a long history of shooting units for the lols. He patches them up after, but he still does. So it's not that hard to pull off.

"I shot the unit to teach him a lesson. I accidentally aimed too high and shot him in the heart." Problem solved.

Normally he shoots them in the feet or non-fatal areas. Most of support knows that, and I'm sure they all have been shot. But they seem to respect him for that and are aware of that. Anyone can shoot a person to stop them if they know almost 100 percent they wont die.

Although this is going off on an odd tangent you can't really fire at any part on a human body knowing "100%" that they won't die, bullets do odd things when they hit bone~

but yes I agree shouldnt be voided etc etc, I'm sure Air expected there to be some negative effects for his char

[Dallas]

Let's not void it. IC = IC.

Just going to say this; if we end up doing some kind of investigation, I won't be using forensics or camera bs because that shit is borderline meta most cases.

[jonco]

Let's not void it. IC = IC.

Just going to say this; if we end up doing some kind of investigation, I won't be using forensics or camera bs because that shit is borderline meta most cases.

I've told people in nova back then that they are not allowed to like find strands of hair or fingerprints unless the person  states it in a note. Same goes with camera/video. Its complete bull and is indeed borderline metagame.

[Reimer]

Let's not void it. IC = IC.

Just going to say this; if we end up doing some kind of investigation, I won't be using forensics or camera bs because that shit is borderline meta most cases.

Couldn't do much forensics regarding units, there being the helmet/mask, gloves, and whatnot. I don't really think anybody leaves anything for forensics anyway without their actions being prearranged in some way.

[Sexy Frog]

It's also not very reassuring on the fact that I am very sure that had the event in the sewers not transpired, virtually nobody would have been the wiser IC or OOC. Had nobody known OOC, this discussion wouldn't be going on right now. That's kind of sad that in order to keep things easy, fun and flowing we have to suddenly become Third Eye or S2 with our actions and keep it on the down low or risk bull shit OOC fights like this.

Please keep this IC. It happened even if you lot don't like it. This should hardly be up for discussion any longer.