High Command RP Ramble

[Doctor Nice roButt]

Just something I want to bring up or make known or w/e. My opinion with how we treat High Command and how we restrict them, which I was discussing with Jonco. I haven't typed up a formal post because I felt like what I said then summed it up.
Beware, there is walls of text.

Toxic Zombie: I understand the whole brainwash rp and you don't want a bunch of rogue units running around, but when it gets to the point where a character is not allowed its own opinion or emotions, the player starts to get bored. Airborne, and even sexy frog, has told me many times on how high command rp is boring. One of the reasons, I think, is that we leave no room for character development. Sure, high ranking characters don't get as much development as, say, a recruit, but there is still room for new and interesting rp that can add to a character. By taking away any room for change or new things, we make rp for those players very boring and stale. No one wants to play a character that stands around all day, orders units, and isn't allowed to think. If we want emotionless yes men to run the CCA, just get an OTA to do it. Both sexy and airborne have shared there dislike of being high command, saying that its getting boring and there's nothing to do. Then airborne goes out and tries to make a new and interesting rp that could add to both of our characters and he's shot down immediately. After the rp, he expressed his excitement and how he wanted to get on more often to do rp, but, now that its being voided, he says he's going to take a break from hl2rp because, like I mentioned earlier, it's incredibly boring to be high command. The whole point of rping is to have fun and make characters and grow them, but we are stifling that when any act of uniqueness is scrutinized and shot down. Yeah, maybe airborne should have checked with kronic to see if it was okay for his character to do that, but it is really disheartening when you have to get every little thing authed in order to do it. Responsible rpers shouldn't be punished for trying to spice it up. I'm not sure if this will change anything, I guess it's all up to what airborne says his characters reasons are and your decisions, but I can only hope that maybe this brings something to light.
Toxic Zombie: Sorry for wall, but yeah
Jonco: S0 is basically ota
Jonco: let me point that out
Toxic Zombie: If s0 is like OTA, why don't s0 characters act like OTA? Sexy frogs unit is s0 and acts nothing like an OTA, plus she never got auths for it
Jonco: Well, that's a different story
Jonco: Sexy Frogs unit never went through augmentation surgery
Toxic Zombie: But she was brainwashed by 158 and after the city 45 event, she had to get augmented by force. If you want s0 to be OTA, why not force all s0 to get brainwashed so the only emotion they have is fear. Or, go even further and just have OTA running the CCA. In my eyes, the reason combine don't use a robot police force is because they need people with emotions to relate to civilians and such. I'm sure they cold have a bunch of robots running around and doing their chores if they wanted, but they don't. And it's logical to want a higher ranking unit to be more loyal and less likely to defect or do things against the union, but they need to have humanity as the people below them also have theirs. OTA don't need humanity because they aren't dealing with civilians on a personal and daily basis. They aren't trying to teach them the law and keep them in line, they're there to hunt a kill. S0 are suppose to be leaders, not robots. If our canon makes them more OTA then unit, maybe we should look over it and perhaps discuss changing it

tl;dr version: We are restricting High Command's rp way too much to the point where its boring to rp as one. We need to give a bit of slack on their leashes. They are High command for a reason; we should trust their RP skill and let them have a bit of lee-way so everyone can enjoy rp. I guess.
idk

Opinions, comments, w/e
Feel free to post.

[Dallas]

I don't feel restricted in the slightest.
017 has personality without being borderline rogue. The S0 are supposed to be essentially Overwatch and that's okay. The Union don't want soft and emotional people leading them.

[Doctor Nice roButt]

I don't feel restricted in the slightest.
017 has personality without being borderline rogue. The S0 are supposed to be essentially Overwatch and that's okay. The Union don't want soft and emotional people leading them.

But this isn't a book; it's an rp. How fun is it to rp a robot that never changes and does the same thing everyday. I understand we need to have regulations, but it shouldn't be so harsh that it makes things a drag to do. Rp shouldn't become a job, it needs to be fun and exciting and interesting.

[tim]

I don't feel restricted in the slightest.
017 has personality without being borderline rogue. The S0 are supposed to be essentially Overwatch and that's okay. The Union don't want soft and emotional people leading them.

if s0 is essentially overwatch they have no free will
meaning all the programs they have created are void

or am i missing something here

[Dallas]

Overwatch in the means of what Overwatch Commanders are. ie: they can lead.

[Mr. Pettit]

I don't feel restricted either like Dallas. And if you're talking about 938, which I'm sure is the reason you're bringing this up there's several reasons (At least for an S0 unit from what I've asked).
- They would be loyalty checked
- Possibly brainwashed
- Augmented

With all of that, they would be augmented, tested true to be loyal to the Union and then brainwashed. My Officer 495 hasn't been brainwashed, memory replaced and has minimal augmentation. When you get to the point of S0, yes it does restrict your rp greatly. But then again it depends on how you play the role. You can have very little or a lot of involvement in your section. Have different emotions, a different process of reacting to situations and interacting with your fellow Units; It's pretty much endless how you can roleplay as a High Command unit among anything else. But yes, I do think there needs to be some freedom with this too but not just "herp derp i'm going rogue after years in the cca" but as of now that's the way it is.

And if Airborne wants to have a rogue unit, make another one and go rogue. It makes MUCH more sense compared to a Section leader who has dedicated their lives and time to the CCA. I try to present a project to him that he requested I do and just tells me It seems good because he was letting you go. That made me a bit mad.

[kronik]

Jon is just using OTA as an example. S0 are brainwashed to the point where they would never betray the union. They have gone through heavy augmentations, and most have developed their personality over many in game years of service. Which means they pretty much don't care about people in the way any normal human would, but they are still, in a sense, 'part' human.

[raged]

i don't view augmentations and loyalty enforcement as having no emotions and acting like a robot, i view it as the absence of certain emotions that would hinder the calculative and reasoning ability of the unit to determine suitable responses to events, like for example not having a second thought about sacrificing fifteen units to capture a priority one AC target.

it sounds like to me you had a chat with sexy frog who's upset he can't slam his fists in CCA s0 meetings anymore because he was forcibly augmented after sustaining serious injuries that wouldn't have occured if he was augmented in the first place.

S0 are brainwashed to the point where they would never betray the union.

i would also disagree with this point as my unit has considered on several occasions of leading a coup d'etat because he felt the sectorial commander was inadequate in fulfilling their role and while that's not necessarily considered betraying the union it would still warrant a potential amputation if he was to fail.

[Airborne1st]

With the rp involving my unit aside, let me just address what augmentation is and does because appears many of you have a misguided view on it. I've led the medical division of the CCA for around 11 months or so now and I've done my fair share of augmentation surgeries. Your brain isn't switched out with a mechanical brain at any point during that surgery. Its intended that you retain your human mind and personality, which is how you've developed your character. Augments are purely physical, only increasing strength and physical aspects. My unit, to my knowledge, was never formerly brainwashed. Now, I won't lie and say he's not loyal to the Union, but throughout my unit's career, I've done things that go against what would be preferred for the sake of my character's development. My character's mind and emotions are purely human. Sure, he's a hardened veteran of the Union who has a long, distinguished service record, but he's also got his secrets and emotional moments. He's a surgeon and he chose that path as an 04 when he joined NOVA to preserve life. Its one of the 4 P's in the NOVA general principles, after all. Occasionally, he pities citizens and see's more than just something wrong in them, bringing forth emotions and emotional reactions. I've developed my character like this from the 04 level to the DvL level and I refuse to stop doing it at the CmD level.

So how does this apply to the RP that occurred with myself and toxic's character? Well for one thing, he ICly saw there was little difference in himself and toxic's character. Just as he's always fought for the Union and served it, her character fought for the people and served them. As I stated earlier, my character's mind is completely human and on very rare occasions, makes decisions that are less favorable by other units and keeps those decisions secret. This is not so unusual for 938.

Let me address another issue. I'm a super admin and I don't feel I should have to get approval to RP anything I can auth myself. And as toxic stated, upper High Command RP get's very stale over time and because of the ungodly amount of restrictions on things, upper High Command RP can never change from the same old shit every day. I decided I'd say fuck it and create a bit of unusual RP that would keep me interested in the game mode and create some different RP for someone else as well, being toxic's character. Is that so wrong? Its not like I did this RP with someone new to HL2RP, it was with a trusted member of the community, and based on my character and what's been done to them in the past, it was acceptable in my opinion and there were no flaws in the RP itself.

Anyway, I was the first to just say oh well and vote to void the RP but the other's involved in this RP were strongly against that and after speaking with them, I decided to retract my void until everything could be reviewed. Based on the statements in this thread, it appears its already been decided that this RP will be voided afterall, which is fine. Due to the events and outcome of this RP, I've become a bit annoyed with HL2RP and those of you with admin board access can see my post in the leave thread section about the time I'm taking to get away from HL2RP for a short while. I've also taken to only talking to a select group of people on steam for awhile.

To continue with the theme of this post, yes upper high command RP is rather stale and get's very boring after a solid year of the same thing over and over again.

Also, just a side note, my unit didn't go rogue and isn't going to go rogue and I'm sorry if I'm not always like the rest of high command and try to kill and pk every high value anti citizen. HL2RP isn't about killing everyone, sometimes its nice to let people who create good RP and who spent 6+ hours writing a book for their character's auth app that got accepted to get away from tight situations to continue to use those characters and have good, fun RP. Few people here seem to ever think about that.

 

[Mr. Busch]

Your brain isn't switched out with a mechanical brain at any point during that surgery. Its intended that you retain your human mind and personality, which is how you've developed your character. Augments are purely physical, only increasing strength and physical aspects.

I'm just going to throw THIS in here because I think you are getting the wrong point. They were not talking about augments constricting how and what your character does due to a brain augment or anything of the sorts. They were talking about "the trust of the union", I guess you would say. The union would not give augments to someone who they believe that will defect or do something that goes against the UU laws and regulations. The union would only give augments to the units they believe that would die for the union and is willing to preserve the union in anyway possible. It would seem like a waste if they just gave augments to a unit who defected or to a unit who went and killed other CCA units before taking his own life.

With all that aside, I do believe high command (just S0) has things that hinder their RP but with good reasoning. And the whole "938 let her go" should of been voided. Even if he wasn't loyalty checked, even if he wasn't brainwashed, even if he wasn't an S0 unit, but the way in which the "sewer fiasco" went down made me strongly go against the whole thing. You two claimed it was meta due to the fact the guy who reported you was down on the other side of the sewer and couldn't see you. I brought up the fact that the citizen would of easily been able to seen your optics in the (dark according to a reason he can't see you two) and you admitted to it and deemed it as a reasonable point, along with a few others that me and the other units came up with. But after that, you then proceeded to still claim meta and which lead to you guys just voiding the whole report. It seemed as if you weren't even listening to the points we were bringing up, yet you admitted to them being reasonable and valid. You just wanted to save your characters/RP.

I try to present a project to him that he requested I do and just tells me It seems good because he was letting you go. That made me a bit mad.

And lets also talk about this. Everything took second place to your RP. The three or four inactive weeks airborne wasn't on city (Not complaining about it because he is S0 so he doesn't have much to do and there are other games and gamemodes other than just city. Just bringing it up for the point ->) caused a build up of projects requests and units who needed to speak to him. But the one moment we had the chance,  we get shut down because of the cyber or what ever you want to call it that you two were doing. And, considering that he most likely isn't going to be on for awhile after this, it just adds to it.

It's been like this for the year I've been in the CCA. Sure, I've been nothing above the ranking of Eu, but I've seen/talked/still chat with a few of the HC members. This "control" over HC units has been around for a long ass time and many people knew this. But no one really "cared". But seriously, I have to ask you, what do you expect to accomplish from this? It wont change a thing and its all over a game. It seems mean but its true. I felt the same enthusiasm you are feeling right now, over something (RADON) that doesn't really matter because its just a game and it doesn't matter "that much." Your life wont be changed or affected by this, and I had a hard time grasping it but eventually I did. Just, move on. It's better for everyone

[Yak]

rofl
'im quitting because high command is boring'
play a citizen

leeway isn't letting a known anti citizen out and giving her a pistol

[smt]

Things shouldn't be voided just because people don't like it (to a point), and yes, HC+ RP is really stale, and I don't REALLY think people who are OfC can really say it is or isn't, because at that point you're more or less still open for a lot of roleplay

[Sexy Frog]

it sounds like to me you had a chat with sexy frog who's upset he can't slam his fists in CCA s0 meetings anymore because he was forcibly augmented after sustaining serious injuries that wouldn't have occured if he was augmented in the first place.

Do me a favor and don't involve me in this like that. I gained a permanent injury that forced me to replace my legs to compensate for the injury, mind you of my own accord. I could have been like everyone else and just did a dumb NLR and been totally fine. So don't pull that card here as a low blow at me when I have done nothing to you. I can still play out 211's emotions an 'slam my fists in CCA s0 meetings' all I please. I don't want to be antagonized for something that happened to me and holds no baring on this discussion. Thanks.

I don't feel restricted either like Dallas. And if you're talking about 938, which I'm sure is the reason you're bringing this up there's several reasons (At least for an S0 unit from what I've asked).
- They would be loyalty checked
- Possibly brainwashed
- Augmented

With all of that, they would be augmented, tested true to be loyal to the Union and then brainwashed. My Officer 495 hasn't been brainwashed, memory replaced and has minimal augmentation. When you get to the point of S0, yes it does restrict your rp greatly. But then again it depends on how you play the role. You can have very little or a lot of involvement in your section. Have different emotions, a different process of reacting to situations and interacting with your fellow Units; It's pretty much endless how you can roleplay as a High Command unit among anything else. But yes, I do think there needs to be some freedom with this too but not just "herp derp i'm going rogue after years in the cca" but as of now that's the way it is.

And if Airborne wants to have a rogue unit, make another one and go rogue. It makes MUCH more sense compared to a Section leader who has dedicated their lives and time to the CCA. I try to present a project to him that he requested I do and just tells me It seems good because he was letting you go. That made me a bit mad.

You and Dallas don't feel restricted as you claim because OfC is, not to sounds superior or like I am looking down on anyone, but a cushy rank. It is the rank where you are essentially in charge but don't really do much. It is a rank where everyone is not afraid that looking at them the wrong way will get them a BM or OWR. You can look at any CmD at any point in time and they will say the same. KmP? He admitted multiple times that CmD was boring because they got hardly any passive due to everyone being scared. Purple? Probably a bad example given his standing in the community, but he said the same none the less. Delta? Very much the same. S0/CmD is a bland and stressful rank.

Also, at no point has Airborne 'gone rogue after being in the cca for a few years'. He did one act in his own interest. That's hardly lolgorogue. That's not being a tool and thinking for ones self. This particular action happened to touch upon Airbornes OWN character's interests. Who are you, or any of you, to dictate someone else's characters emotions/feelings? Not to mention that Batman did nothing overly horrible. She didn't kill or hurt anyone. The most she did was Sociocide Level 1, Obstruction of Justice, Level Two Contraband, Capital Malcompliance and Aiding in escape of a fugitive. As far as Airborne's character was concerned, as he stated, they shared common interest that struck a nerve. Every good character has their defects. Maybe Airborne's character figured, "Well, she didn't really hurt anyone and she did show loyalty to a cause that is kinda similar to my own. These are all amputate-able charges so...why not fake her death?"

Things shouldn't be voided just because people don't like it (to a point), and yes, HC+ RP is really stale, and I don't REALLY think people who are OfC can really say it is or isn't, because at that point you're more or less still open for a lot of roleplay

Finally, this. Very much this. Let it play out. The CCA is going to catch Batman as some point. Be real, it's a totalitarian police state. It's inevitable. What is so bad about letting it drag out and having fun with it? Do you guys really wanna stomp this out so bad that you can't let it run out a bit?

[raged]

i have no problem with the fact airbourne let her escape but why was arming her necessary

[Sexy Frog]

i have no problem with the fact airbourne let her escape but why was arming her necessary

Revoke the pistol then. Void the pistol part. Why is that so hard? I don't see a need for the whole thing to be voided.