What I Expected to Encounter With HL2RP, And What I Really Found

[That Guy in a Box]

It was a time when I still was a WoW RPer, enjoying to go on my Military RP char Goknak a lot, I soon found out that Garry's Mod actually had Role play servers. I was quickly enticed by the footage I saw of the group of friends that embarked around on Rebel-like characters causing mayhem and just plain old fun wherever they had trekked. It seemed to be fairly nice, although the RP on those servers seemed to highly downgrade as far as things like /mes. It seemed to be something that I hoped to encounter and enjoy. (Also taking note this took place on a C18 map)

Then as I soon quit WoW, I decided to see what this Gmod RP was like. As I first enter I notice that the map was similar to the one in HL2, well, at least the Plaza. I, myself, wanted to become a Resistance member. As I soon discover that there really was no City Resistance RP, I tried to create ones of my own. Only doomed to fail as I had no idea how this would work. It very quickly became the complete opposite of what I'd hoped for. Though, I'm not trying to say it's not fun to go on the HL2RP servers, I do find it to be different to what I'd seen. I soon learned it was highly biased towards CCA RP, as if it was the Golden child of a family with two others highly neglected.

This may just be due to that most of my gaming friends either were shitting clueless about RP and did not own Gmod. Or that my RP friends were mostly busy with the WoW RP, and could not join me. Any-who, I like the servers, but it they to lack what attracted me in the first place.

Meh, I'm not that big of a person around here so I'm just gonna assume no one gives...

[Sexy Frog]

WoW players ftw! I used to play World of Warcraft but I never managed to try the RP side though I always wanted to and I will ask, what was it like? I plan to get back into it when Mists of Pandaria comes out even though it seems really dumb. But I digress.

There have been rebellious groups in the past, I assure as I have seen them and I was apart of one. They are quite the enigma if done correctly but a good number of the time, the rebel groups fail due to some major reasons.

• They advertise too openly, thus leading to their demise.
• They suffer from inactivity and poor maintenance.
• Loss of interest, poor RP, forced inaction or lack of members to really do anything.

Usually a lot of the rebellious groups of the past and maybe even the present suffer from one or more of these. But I am sure that with the right people and the right mind set it is entirely possible.

[That Guy in a Box]

WoW players ftw! I used to play World of Warcraft but I never managed to try the RP side though I always wanted to and I will ask, what was it like? I plan to get back into it when Mists of Pandaria comes out even though it seems really dumb. But I digress.

WoW RP is very fun, but also very uptight. If you wanted the utter best RP your /e, or in Gmod terms /mes had to be paragraphs long at the least, and even as they expanded the chat it's still not nearly the capacity. I swear, if they boosted it even higher I'd have be able to finally make my seemingly essays of combat RP, and paragraphs of seemingly ordinary tasks. I myself was part of a highly prestigious Guild, the First Regiment. It was mainly Soldier RP about the Human and Dwarf Alliance's forces. It was so difficult to get by I myself never got past Private before quitting. Weapons were obviously one of the easiest things, and no one had a choice but to /me their Combat RP since inter-faction PvP is not in WoW.

[Atticat]

I played World of Warcraft for a LONG time. I played on PVP and RP-PVP servers. The problem is RP-PVP gets filled pretty hardcore with people who don't like to roleplay and PVE is for pussys. (I'm just joking, but I am a pretty competitive gamer)

Anyways, yeah. I'm not really sure who is making the shots for the development calls about CCA. IMO half the Nexus needs to get the chop chop. I mean, let's get some stuff straight here, HL2RP is supposed to be about living in an Orwellian city. The CCA busting doors down when you're trying to cook tea in your apartment is what that's all about. I dig that stuff. Somewhere along the line the CCA let the power get to their heads and started seeing it as "us vs them" OOC instead of a community working together.

If you ask many CCA OOC about the Nexus, even over steam, they won't tell you because it's "classified". That is such an insult to a community that is supposed to be working together to make a fun game.

See the Stanford prison experiment http://www.prisonexp.org/
This is actually what happened. The CCA immersed into their roles so deeply even within an online game that they've started to believe they really are authority and so arrogance and disdain towards the citizens OOC in the actual community started to breed in them. This is ok if it's about your character. The problem is most of the admins are CCA and don't care about citizen role-play, there are NEVER organizers on and citizens get almost no additions from patches. Some admins have the guts to talk to me about RSO if you add on/off switches to UCH apartments when every patch the Nexus gets even more bloated.

P2 was removed (it was a failure of a district in their defense) so what do they do? Add a fucking ELEVATOR from the Nexus up to where it used to be. Can't operate without that. How many useless training rooms are in the Nexus? What about the stasis room? WHAT IS THAT EVEN THERE FOR??? CCA leaders get custom models but citizens are stuck with the same drab selection of characters. The UCH got tarnished with that ugly door on the third floor. There is a CCA room in the subway for whatever reason.

They have access to: Scanners, hunters, and OTA units (for the record I like all of these, but they are examples of the MASSIVE amount of content the CCA receive)
The CCA are allowed to keep information classified even when asked over the forums (meta-gaming is USING that information), as if they are a specially entitled group

CCA have a firing range
They have interrogation rooms
They have amputation chairs
They have a working shower (Had to have that one)
They have a medical bay (Can't even give CWU a new fucking hospital)
They have an armory for all the guns they will never have to use

These are just some of the problems listed. Should the CCA have some of them? Yeah, I understand interrogation rooms and medical bays etc, even a firing range! But there is a LOT of stuff they don't need, and a LOT of stuff they get attention paid to that citizens get laughed at when asked for.

Why don't rebellion groups work? Because it's not actually possible. The CCA know all and control all. One time some friends got caught because they sent a loyalist a message via radio that there was a secret entrance in the D6 bar. Fuck that.

[Statua]

Resistance RP is the most difficult in HL2RP. Within seconds, your group can go from thriving to dead due to a small error. However, if you play on the Outlands server, the resistance RP is much easier there and it's also a form of survival RP.

[Orange - Cisco Certified]

If you ask many CCA OOC about the Nexus, even over steam, they won't tell you because it's "classified". That is such an insult to a community that is supposed to be working together to make a fun game.

Meta is a pretty good reason for why that makes sense, although the regular divisions of the CCA don't have much to hide, if you can't discover what they're hiding after about ten minutes of scoping them out, then you're not trying hard enough.

The CCA are allowed to keep information classified even when asked over the forums (meta-gaming is USING that information), as if they are a specially entitled group

Again, metagaming is a real thing, why would you inquire about a certain topic if you didn't wish to use that information? Personally I have never seen this type of behavior outside ZEALOT matters. A few examples would be nice.

CCA have a firing range
They have interrogation rooms
They have amputation chairs
They have a working shower (Had to have that one)
They have a medical bay (Can't even give CWU a new fucking hospital)
They have an armory for all the guns they will never have to use

Are you saying you'd like to have all of those things? By all means, make them. All you require is prop spawning flags and you can have all of that (minus the guns). Also, we don't have a working shower. All of these things have been added to give the CCA some passive RP spaces. If you want to compare spaces to spaces, just look at P3. You could make any one of those rooms you listed in the warehouse alone. None do because fuckall.

Why don't rebellion groups work? Because it's not actually possible. The CCA know all and control all. One time some friends got caught because they sent a loyalist a message via radio that there was a secret entrance in the D6 bar. Fuck that.

This community's rebel base really disgusts me. If it weren't against my OOC rules I would make a rebel group just to quiet the bunch of you. Making a rebel group is not hard, you all seem to have it stamped into your minds that you need guns and killing CPs in-order to have rebel RP. Then the lot of you get mad when after you burn down a shop in P1, you're killed for being too open with your group.  I have yet to see an actual rebel group that isn't filled with a bunch of people who would let in some guy that had a loyalist armband so long as his /me was good (except third eye xoxox).

Making a rebellion group is not hard, avoiding the CCA is even easier. You people need to organize and use your brain, half of you don't even know what it means to rebel against the CCA considering all you've done is tried the primary form which is to fuck everything and kill everyone.

[ReconPWN??????]

See the Stanford prison experiment http://www.prisonexp.org/
This is actually what happened. The CCA immersed into their roles so deeply even within an online game that they've started to believe they really are authority and so arrogance and disdain towards the citizens OOC in the actual community started to breed in them.

Because you know using a 41 year old experiment really applies to a video game based community which is amazingly not real life and is a video game. So the power hungry aspect just flies out the window.

Not to mention the new map update will completely revise P3 in favor for the citizens
http://www.catalyst-gaming.net/index.php?topic=16994.60

Claiming that the CCA has too much power is senile this is how the cannon works you need to be more secret about your "operations" than you think.

As for the CWU I agree in sense. The CCA take most if not all the medical operations (Namely me) so lately I have been sending minor or not so serious medical problems that citizens have to a CWU Med if I see one on. Aside from that you can't do much since the UU in this cannon won't give workers that much knowledge or room to do their treatments. 

[Toxilium]

[alaskan thunderfuck]

yeah, city is based more around CCA RP. That's to be expected, considering it is a city, with a nexus and all. Not going to be easy to rebel and get away with it. Sure, we could have more resistance RP but we also have outlands for that. I'll talk to oz about having more shit based around resistance RP in the next version but seriously, go to outlands

[Toxilium]

yeah, city is based more around CCA RP. That's to be expected, considering it is a city, with a nexus and all. Not going to be easy to rebel and get away with it. Sure, we could have more resistance RP but we also have outlands for that. I'll talk to oz about having more shit based around resistance RP in the next version but seriously, go to outlands

While it makes sense for the CCA to be a dominant force in the city, are we all forgetting what the city should be centralized around -  the citizen? CCA are merely a police force. They may have branches for medical, intelligence, civil service, you name it, but at the end of the day they're just police. Acting conspicuously, resistance should be able to theoretically operate in the city. Hell, they even did it during HL2.

[garry :D]

Rebel RP transcends having a gun and a vest; it's about 'sticking it to the man' in your own private way and it carries an IC consequence where if you do things openly then you'll probably get killed within a week. On the 30th of August I can proudly say that I've survived on Daniel Slater for 12 months.

After doing a survey of about 20 members (ranging from new > veteran) of what they would choose to fix in HL2RP, I collated their answers and came up with this:

Civil Administration
•   Fixing the Civil Administration faction to give more IC responsibilities whilst clearing up OOC perceptions about the group.

•   Setting rank responsibilities out in stone:

Consul: considered critical for the success of public relations efforts between citizens and the Universal Unions affiliate organisations. Duties include being responsible and accountable for keeping all Administrators in check and approving City related projects (which are not military in nature, of course). All work is conducted inside the Nexus unless it is a specially planned event. Comparable to the Governor of a state in America.

Administrator: considered to be essential though expendable to public relations. Duties include writing speeches, persuading the citizens to contribute to society in a legal and meaningful manner and scheduling personal one-on-one appointments with citizens as well as being accountable for the actions of Representatives. The majority of their work is takes place inside the Nexus, although they can make public appearances for authorised ‘special occasions’. Comparable to a town mayor.

Representative: considered to be non-essential and expendable personnel who are generally charged with the ground work which forms part of the propaganda efforts directed at citizens on a constant basis. Duties include meeting citizens in the streets, listening to their concerns with an open ear and forming bonds with them to sway them to the viewpoint of the Union. The majority of their work takes place outside of the Nexus. Comparable to an individual who manages a small committee of townspeople looking to make a change.

Passive RP
•   Implementation of a citizen schedule (curfew, work hours, ‘break time’) to stimulate citizen RP which is widely regarded as stale, and boring. Attempts should be made to turn this OOC perception into an IC mood – of course citizens are going to feel bored when they have a strict schedule but what’s even more boring is the lack of a schedule.

•   The state of the CWU - are there improvements to be made or perhaps a rival organisation can be formed with a separate set of goals/methods which could serve as IC competition?

•   De-centralizing the emphasis placed on CCA RP by increasing IC interactions with them.

Resistance
•   Stimulating 'good' Resistance RP and the issue of pop-up gangs - the Wolves, for example had a disjointed backstory as to their formation and weren’t really contributing to anything and now that The Castle is based in the Outlands, the city is dried up and is mostly devoid of a source for criminal RP. How do we solve this?

They're all valid points, but if you want to do rebel RP in what could be considered a proper way then it's a matter of trial and error. I had the eye of my very first character torn out during a harsh interrogation and it served to become an icon of Third Eye back in those days.

Whatever happens, just go with the flow unless something is truly unfair, you can always appeal your death or a situation on the forums.

As for having a non-citizen centered map, I don't suppose you've been keeping up with the next update: http://www.catalyst-gaming.net/index.php?topic=16994.0

While on the surface it looks like the CCA has it all, true revolutionaries play on their weaknesses.

[The Mysterious Stranger]

 Making a rebel group that is actually hidden from the public is quite hard. You can't just spread papers around and start a recruitment right off the bat, you have to spy on those who you wish to be trustworthy and those who YOU want. I use my recruitment system like this, not just show yourself to the public and allow those to come right infront of your face and say "Hey, I saw your recruiting paper back there, may I join?" I use it because I don't want my group to become highly exposed and it also brings you, the leader to pick out rebels and loyalists. You pick a undercover loyalist and you are fucked. They don't automatically join though, they must be able to be watched on a 7 day basis.

 You must not show yourself to the public. I use authorizations in order to gain clothing in order to hide my appearance from the public via being facial details and appearance. Also, don't tell out your names, that is why the Black Monolith uses nicknames instead of character names. They are answered questions on what the new members do. Plus, you do not under any circumstances spray around logos that reveals your group. Yes, I reveal my group with the main quote of our group but one must find clues about what this really means, not just metagame it.

 I created a thread to organize things in the group such as the ranking system, character names, known status, where they are at and so forth to keep it organized. The Wolves for example don't have a thread but the Black Monolith do. One individual who must join the group must be able to do this:

 1. Find out clues about the group (i.e. we use our quote "Secrets flow through the air with cause.")
 2. Find out who the monolithians AKA members are in the group.
 3. Find out whose the leader.
 4. Must be around these people in order to join.

 EDIT 1: Progression will be revealed in the days to come since I have been very inactive.

[Atticat]

If you ask many CCA OOC about the Nexus, even over steam, they won't tell you because it's "classified". That is such an insult to a community that is supposed to be working together to make a fun game.

Meta is a pretty good reason for why that makes sense, although the regular divisions of the CCA don't have much to hide, if you can't discover what they're hiding after about ten minutes of scoping them out, then you're not trying hard enough.

The CCA are allowed to keep information classified even when asked over the forums (meta-gaming is USING that information), as if they are a specially entitled group

I don't want any of those things, I was speaking of the many things CCA has. Furthermore, the CCA do not have a right to keep them secret. What is this? The FBI? It's a VIDEO GAME. We are all apart of the same community. What about people who have a CCA and citizen character? By your logic they shouldn't be able to because they have information as a citizen OOC that they shouldn't IC.

Again, metagaming is a real thing, why would you inquire about a certain topic if you didn't wish to use that information? Personally I have never seen this type of behavior outside ZEALOT matters. A few examples would be nice.

CCA have a firing range
They have interrogation rooms
They have amputation chairs
They have a working shower (Had to have that one)
They have a medical bay (Can't even give CWU a new fucking hospital)
They have an armory for all the guns they will never have to use

Are you saying you'd like to have all of those things? By all means, make them. All you require is prop spawning flags and you can have all of that (minus the guns). Also, we don't have a working shower. All of these things have been added to give the CCA some passive RP spaces. If you want to compare spaces to spaces, just look at P3. You could make any one of those rooms you listed in the warehouse alone. None do because fuckall.

Why don't rebellion groups work? Because it's not actually possible. The CCA know all and control all. One time some friends got caught because they sent a loyalist a message via radio that there was a secret entrance in the D6 bar. Fuck that.

This community's rebel base really disgusts me. If it weren't against my OOC rules I would make a rebel group just to quiet the bunch of you. Making a rebel group is not hard, you all seem to have it stamped into your minds that you need guns and killing CPs in-order to have rebel RP. Then the lot of you get mad when after you burn down a shop in P1, you're killed for being too open with your group.  I have yet to see an actual rebel group that isn't filled with a bunch of people who would let in some guy that had a loyalist armband so long as his /me was good (except third eye xoxox).

Making a rebellion group is not hard, avoiding the CCA is even easier. You people need to organize and use your brain, half of you don't even know what it means to rebel against the CCA considering all you've done is tried the primary form which is to fuck everything and kill everyone.

I don't want any of those things, I was speaking of the many things CCA has. Furthermore, the CCA do not have a right to keep them secret. What is this? The FBI? It's a VIDEO GAME. We are all apart of the same community. What about people who have a CCA and citizen character? By your logic they shouldn't be able to because they have information as a citizen OOC that they shouldn't IC.

What are you going to do as a rebel? Go hang out in the one bar in D6? There isn't even any content for the citizens. The sewers are excellent imo, but the subway should not have some super secretz CCA one way window. There is such little content it's ridiculous. Compare all of my examples to rebel content, I dare you.

Sure, I actually admit and like that being a rebel in the City isn't about guns, but there is nowhere to be and nowhere to hide. Somebody needs to have paid actual money for you to acquire radios, yeah that's balanced all right.

By the way, I ain't some minge rebel. I played CWU for a long time and enjoyed it (even though they were starved of content because of the CCA bias in the game), and frankly, rebel/citizen content comes first.

Another good example is the whole ordeal with Sectus. I am not talking about who is right and wrong, only that somebody claimed a scanner should be able to discern a person's identity based off their body size. There has to be some kind of balance to make the game fun, or the CCA are just a bunch of sick power hungry internet bullies.
Post Auto-Merged: August 07, 2012, 08:25:54 PM

Rebel RP transcends having a gun and a vest; it's about 'sticking it to the man' in your own private way and it carries an IC consequence where if you do things openly then you'll probably get killed within a week. On the 30th of August I can proudly say that I've survived on Daniel Slater for 12 months.

After doing a survey of about 20 members (ranging from new > veteran) of what they would choose to fix in HL2RP, I collated their answers and came up with this:

Civil Administration
•   Fixing the Civil Administration faction to give more IC responsibilities whilst clearing up OOC perceptions about the group.

•   Setting rank responsibilities out in stone:

Consul: considered critical for the success of public relations efforts between citizens and the Universal Unions affiliate organisations. Duties include being responsible and accountable for keeping all Administrators in check and approving City related projects (which are not military in nature, of course). All work is conducted inside the Nexus unless it is a specially planned event. Comparable to the Governor of a state in America.

Administrator: considered to be essential though expendable to public relations. Duties include writing speeches, persuading the citizens to contribute to society in a legal and meaningful manner and scheduling personal one-on-one appointments with citizens as well as being accountable for the actions of Representatives. The majority of their work is takes place inside the Nexus, although they can make public appearances for authorised ‘special occasions’. Comparable to a town mayor.

Representative: considered to be non-essential and expendable personnel who are generally charged with the ground work which forms part of the propaganda efforts directed at citizens on a constant basis. Duties include meeting citizens in the streets, listening to their concerns with an open ear and forming bonds with them to sway them to the viewpoint of the Union. The majority of their work takes place outside of the Nexus. Comparable to an individual who manages a small committee of townspeople looking to make a change.

Passive RP
•   Implementation of a citizen schedule (curfew, work hours, ‘break time’) to stimulate citizen RP which is widely regarded as stale, and boring. Attempts should be made to turn this OOC perception into an IC mood – of course citizens are going to feel bored when they have a strict schedule but what’s even more boring is the lack of a schedule.

•   The state of the CWU - are there improvements to be made or perhaps a rival organisation can be formed with a separate set of goals/methods which could serve as IC competition?

•   De-centralizing the emphasis placed on CCA RP by increasing IC interactions with them.

Resistance
•   Stimulating 'good' Resistance RP and the issue of pop-up gangs - the Wolves, for example had a disjointed backstory as to their formation and weren’t really contributing to anything and now that The Castle is based in the Outlands, the city is dried up and is mostly devoid of a source for criminal RP. How do we solve this?

They're all valid points, but if you want to do rebel RP in what could be considered a proper way then it's a matter of trial and error. I had the eye of my very first character torn out during a harsh interrogation and it served to become an icon of Third Eye back in those days.

Whatever happens, just go with the flow unless something is truly unfair, you can always appeal your death or a situation on the forums.

As for having a non-citizen centered map, I don't suppose you've been keeping up with the next update: http://www.catalyst-gaming.net/index.php?topic=16994.0

While on the surface it looks like the CCA has it all, true revolutionaries play on their weaknesses.

I commend you Oz for playing Daniel Slater and giving the Citizen's some content, but it is very late and very dissapointing, especially since the summer is coming to an end. Despite this, I hope you are up to the challenge and I am confident that you are and I'm excited to see where the server will go.

Anyways, as far as the CCA having it all, I'm talking about content, which is irrefutable, period. Looks like you're working to change this and I am very impressed. Personally I think a lot of the Nexus needs to be removed. No reason for half the crap in there. Anyway, applause to you and CG is lucky to have an admin like that. [/b/ I wish I could be around for it.
Post Auto-Merged: August 07, 2012, 08:35:28 PM

See the Stanford prison experiment http://www.prisonexp.org/
This is actually what happened. The CCA immersed into their roles so deeply even within an online game that they've started to believe they really are authority and so arrogance and disdain towards the citizens OOC in the actual community started to breed in them.

Because you know using a 41 year old experiment really applies to a video game based community which is amazingly not real life and is a video game. So the power hungry aspect just flies out the window.

Not to mention the new map update will completely revise P3 in favor for the citizens
http://www.catalyst-gaming.net/index.php?topic=16994.60

Claiming that the CCA has too much power is senile this is how the cannon works you need to be more secret about your "operations" than you think.

As for the CWU I agree in sense. The CCA take most if not all the medical operations (Namely me) so lately I have been sending minor or not so serious medical problems that citizens have to a CWU Med if I see one on. Aside from that you can't do much since the UU in this cannon won't give workers that much knowledge or room to do their treatments.

Alright let's take a look at this. First of all, an experiment being 41 years old has nothing to do with it's validity.
                                                      Second, the Stanford Prison Experiments were artificial, do you know what a game is? It's an artificial environment. Did I claim CCA to have the stress of the real life students acting as guards in the experiment? No. Only that the position creates an us vs them to many of the dedicated CCA members, transforming their perception of the community. If you think they aren't power hungry, hell PEOPLE in general, then you are out of your mind in denial. Almost every single update this summer has been for CCA content. How you could even say something like that is "out the window" boggles my mind. You are thinking in black and white colors to simplify things which never solve the problem.

Is senile? Once again son, it's a game. Why don't the CCA patrol D6, oh yeah, it's a game where some balance is supposed to be applied to make it interesting and fun. Seems you're the senile one that forgot key details about D6's rules.

At any rate, the new update is great and I hope the community enjoys it and I agree with you on it.

[ReDrUm?´´?´°]

If you ask many CCA OOC about the Nexus, even over steam, they won't tell you because it's "classified". That is such an insult to a community that is supposed to be working together to make a fun game.

Lol, what? While ICly most CCA info IS classified, OOCly, it's all well known. The only real time someone will tell you it's classified is when it comes to ZEALOT, and don't feel so left out because that information is classified when it comes to units. Shit, I have an OfC and he still has little to no information about ZEALOT, both ICly and OOCly.

Also, I don't see many people in the CCA acting like they OOCly have authority. Of course there are your select few who have a huge ass heads OOCly, but it's a CCA rule that you HAVE to be nice to citizens OOCly. If they are being a douche with their fake sense of OOC authority, then report them to a higher ranking unit in the CCA.

[Roven :D]

OzJackal is the greatest hope we have for changing things in this community aside from RTLKarma and admins who've voiced publicly their agreements with our grievances. As the loudest bitching mouth in this community I can proudly state that I do see progress and things being done to respond to the countless threads made on this subject over the months and slowly but surely they are tweaking the place to appeal to all audiences.

At this point I can only encourage those that agree with me and OP and our entire unofficial committee for this to start pumping your ideas to the two admins mentioned by pm unless you have a complaint about something you want removed or a policy that is in the rules. Send that shit to RoflWaffle, Kronic and Tomasas because they're the only ones who can do it. Like post limits for application, ratio rules, new content and removal of coca content to make room for citizen and rebel content.

We dont ask for anything or any special treatment except near to the same treatment that the CCA gets.