Serious Debate (ALL OPINONS ARE RESPECTED, NO TROLLS!)

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

Ok, I feel that this community is mature enough for a debate. Please vote on a debate of the following choices:
1. Religion
2. Illegal Immigration
3. The best gun
4. Ways to end the economic downgrade (Europeans and Americans can talk)
5. Oil and its alternatives
Debates can run in form of long reports to short comments. Long comments are much appreicated. NO TROLLS! DONT GET OFF TOPIC. CHOOSE YOUR SUBJECT FOR DEBATE!
PLEASE NOTICE I HAVE ADDED 2 MORE TOPICS WHICH ARE MORE OF A RELAXED DEBATE SUBJECT
1. Most Progressive Man on Earth
2. Best book and the story behind it

[Journeyman H. [UK]]

This is a serious debate, he asked what subject to pick, if you have nothing important to say, then don't.
All posts above will be removed, as it's a debate, therefore, rickroller is asking for people who can actually make a topic and debate over the main issues.

[Desperado]

I believe that Religion should be done away with it causes way to many problems and is just a way of keeping people under control. The only reason the catholics came to be was because the Romans where like ah shit we need a way to keep these people under control and we need to make money. Religion makes money of people believe the bullshit they come up with.

Religion has causing wars through out time. Right not Muslim extremest brain wash their childern into hating the west, then tell them if they go blow themselves up kill a few other people they will go to paradise and be greeted by many virgins etc.

Religion wouldnt be that big of a problem if people didnt try to force their religion onto other people. If people accepted what other people believe things wouldnt get out of control. The pricks at the top who tell the others what to do need to be shot. If they believe that blowing yourself up will take you to paradise why dont they go and fucking do it themselves.

   

[Journeyman H. [UK]]

In my opinion, christianity has been trampled on by so many religious leaders, they made up the rules telling people what to do and what not to do.
Which is effectively breaking the ten commandments of "Do not idol anyone else but god", which is why religion is no good to us anymore.

Back then, when things cannot be explained like plagues, disasters, etc, everyone saw it as god being angry, but religion was effective when it comes to law, but not for modern times.

Religion causes arguments and conflicts more than ever. You now have extremists being taught the wrong things. I.e. forcing women to wear burkas, and not allowing them to have freedom for themselves.

There is a fine line between 'Believing in your religion' and 'forcing it' upon people, many people in many religious groups seem to force that on other people, and not respecting their boundaries, that is the main problem for everyone.

[Rory]

OIL AND IT'S ALTERNATIVES

I think we should all know what happened to the oil industries whether selling gas for cars, or using your heating for the heating bills, it went overboard real fast. Most people say oil is running out (I agree with that statement), but also in America we have different problems incurring to the oil industries, and how inflation has occurred to the oil uses of today.

For gas, we use in cars... Right? Now cars have been making special ways to get gas to either not be such a big deal, or not use it at all. I remember Obama saying in one of his speech earlier this year... "We will have electric usable mobiles by the era of 2050." To me, it sounds like it can happen, but right now, we kinda are doing the same thing. I see Hybrids all over town, hell all over the whole country, and we also have a queue of a year and a half to get these bad boys. Thats right, a year and a half queue to get one hybrid... Insane, am i right? People aren't just all over gas for your car though, we are having solutions made within these. For planes though, your dreaming to get gas for planes. I used to use Virgin Airlines back a long while ago when i was 4 years old. We can't even see that many people using them anymore. If i were to get into a good airline, the best one i can ever find is American Airlines. They are the only one people can afford these days here in the United States. Sad, but very true.

Heating bills, and oil for your stove, Thats the one you really gotta watch... I got my heating bill in the mail the other say showing the total of 5000 dollars for the winter month. I really didn't know how to read oil bills, but im pretty sure i was reading something that looked like Total = 5000 U.S.D. If only we had the urge to either not waste our money on war, which we already did back when George Bush sending 300,000,000 U.S.D to the war every god damn month. That was for different reasons too. We also don't have the right, or even can't find an oil field to mine in. It's like trying to find food in a Fallout. Back to George Bush being the president, we did need to go to war, but also the money was way too much, thats another story. It's gone to the point where even out own economy with trillions of dollars can't even get one little oilfield.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

I love you home boys. I just love you. Thank you for bringing your debate face on. First topic is religion. All of the past posts on different subjects are valid. Just give me a hour cause I just woke up and I can abrly see. Ok guys, give me another hour cause I have to a load of math work for regeants. So, please be patient.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

Ok, I am chaniging the rules around, we are doing free style. Im gonna do my thing about after this post Oil then religion, then the best gun. This how we go. The subject I am adding is, Most Progressive Man on Earth. Please use brain, large rpeorts that maybe you have made in the past are greatly appreicated.
This a report I wrote I think its preety good. Its a collaberation of the report and some new things
Vroom! Vroom! The car starts.  The family gets into their car and drives off into the sunset.  The places that they were going to would take days if they were walking.  The only other option were trains and they did not stop at specific points.  The reason for the invention of the car was to get from point a to point b faster.  It connected families and society.  We use our cars everyday, but someone had to make a car that was affordable and durable.
   The man who accomplished that task was Henry Ford.  His thought was to make a car that was affordable and durable.  Before, cars were only play toys for the rich.  The car was sold for $10,000 in those days, which is equal to $167,597 in 2009 (Friedman, 2009).  Because of his invention we don’t have to take hours to simply go to a supermarket far away, now we can go to other places more often. The economy and society is forever changed.
   Henry Ford was born on July 30, 1863, in Greenfield Township, now Dearborn, Michigan.  He grew up on a farm in Greenfield and could of easily just have stayed a farmer, but something dragged him towards mechanisms.  When he was young he started fixing people’s watches (Amnet).  He grew up and made his first steam engine when he was 15, even though he had very limited education.  When he was 16 he became a machinist apprentice (Amnet).
   In 1888, Henry Ford married Clara Bryant and moved to a farm in Dearborn. They had a child named Edsel Bryant Ford. During 1891 to 1899, he became a mechanical engineer for the Edison Illuminating.
   Then in 1896, he build the first quadricycle, also known as the horseless carriage. This is thought to be one of his biggest successes. It was never even close to the power of the cars of today and even his famous Model T, but this invention was the starting point of his business career. Until this invention, he was experimenting to make the car affordable and durable, but because of it, he understood what to do next. It was the starting point for the invention that would soon change the world.
   In 1899, Henry Ford left Edison and went to the Detroit Automobile Company which only produced a few cars. He wanted to be in “bigger leagues”, so he left to go and build his own company for racing cars. In 1901, he was chief engineer of  Henry Ford Motor Company. At this time cars where still built one at a time, so Ford saw that if this was changed to a faster process, his future business career could be changed, as well. He combined ideas from George Eastman to use standardized parts to make the car more durable. Finical advisors had a dispute with him and refused to finance his idea.
   Then in 1902 Henry Motor Company became Cadillac Motor Company, but his own racing car company was not enough for Ford to get supporters. He then started a new company named Ford Motor Company, founded on July 16, 1903.
   July 20th, 1903, the world was changed. The first Model A car was sold to a Detroit Physician. “With the first sale,” said The Great Idea Finder, “the steps of the young company reached high stats.” The world was forever changed.
   Now, because of this newfound invention which was loved by all of America, Henry Ford, in 1907, promised to bring in a even more durable car that would be used by many people and be inexpensive. Ford’s engineers surprised America again and invented the Model T. It first sold for $850, but the major problem was that Ford could not meet the demand.  Then, Ford came up with an idea that revolutionized industry, the assembly line.
   The assembly line opened new horizons for business, named Mass-Production. Mass-production would later lead to a huge amount of products. What would happen was that one person would work on one part of the product and do nothing else but that part. It sped up production time, which equaled money which equals power. Now, people cared about what Ford said and his ideas became important.
   The major success of Ford made astronomical power for him. Now the car was selling for as much as $250, and that fulfilled his promise. The car was now affordable and was used for serious reasons, not just play toys for the rich like it was back in 1870. His work revolutionized the world. He turned the world over and truly reformed industry.
   Today the assembly line is used in most companies. Some of the companies of today would not be as successful if it wasn’t for this great man. The assembly line also increased urbanization, because of this upspring of more products, more people were attracted to cities. It attracted so many people to America and we might not have had other ideas that we have today.
   So, remember when you turn on your engine and start your car, that Henry Ford might have taken a long time to build the affordable car.  His efforts affect us today and will surly affect us in the future.






Works Cited
Ament, Phil. "Inventor Henry Ford Biography." The Great Idea Finder - Celebrating the    Spirit of Innovation. Troy MI: ©1997-2007, n.d. Web. 11 Jan. 2011.             <http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventors/ford.htm>.
Ford, Henry, and Samuel Crowther. My Life and Work,. Garden City, NY: Doubleday,    Page &, 1922. Print.
Freidman, S. Morgan. "The Inflation Calculator." The Homepage Du Jour of S. Morgan    Friedman. N.p., n.d. Web. 11 Jan. 2011. <http://www.westegg.com/inflation/>.
Museum, Henry Ford. "The Henry Ford: The Life of Henry Ford." The Henry Ford:    America's Greatest History Attraction Home Page. The Henry Ford, n.d. Web. 11          Jan. 2011. <http://www.hfmgv.org/exhibits/hf/>.


DONT COPY SOMETHING THAT YOU DIDNT DO

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

In my opinion, christianity has been trampled on by so many religious leaders, they made up the rules telling people what to do and what not to do.
Which is effectively breaking the ten commandments of "Do not idol anyone else but god", which is why religion is no good to us anymore.

Back then, when things cannot be explained like plagues, disasters, etc, everyone saw it as god being angry, but religion was effective when it comes to law, but not for modern times.

Religion causes arguments and conflicts more than ever. You now have extremists being taught the wrong things. I.e. forcing women to wear burkas, and not allowing them to have freedom for themselves.

There is a fine line between 'Believing in your religion' and 'forcing it' upon people, many people in many religious groups seem to force that on other people, and not respecting their boundaries, that is the main problem for everyone.

Could not of said it better. I have a belief, but Im not gonan shove down people's throats. Sadly thats the insanity of the Dark Ages. With posts like this, we will have great debates. Nice job

[The Doctor, RIP Juggernaut]

In my opinion, christianity has been trampled on by so many religious leaders, they made up the rules telling people what to do and what not to do.
Which is effectively breaking the ten commandments of "Do not idol anyone else but god", which is why religion is no good to us anymore.

Back then, when things cannot be explained like plagues, disasters, etc, everyone saw it as god being angry, but religion was effective when it comes to law, but not for modern times.

Religion causes arguments and conflicts more than ever. You now have extremists being taught the wrong things. I.e. forcing women to wear burkas, and not allowing them to have freedom for themselves.

There is a fine line between 'Believing in your religion' and 'forcing it' upon people, many people in many religious groups seem to force that on other people, and not respecting their boundaries, that is the main problem for everyone.

I agree on this I do think there is a higher power BUT I do not follow Christianity nor Islam or Jewish
But heres whats funny now you can not have a shirt saying: God bless america or any thing with god in it or you get kicked out.
Muslims have one god, The jews have one god.
But what gets people is that the shirts like that are banned from schools because they offend people the shirts didn't list what god just a god.

Theres a point where I think that people should just shutup about what people think you won't be able to tell a teacher what he/she has been teaching was lies and bullshit.

And when you force people to ware stuff like burkas and if she just KISSES a man that she isn't married to she gets stone and tossed in jail but the man can get away with it THEN I have an issue.

When you FORCE some one to think in a way THEN I have an issue.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

Im going to keep very active on this topic here. Lets get some posts about who you think is the Most Progressive Man on Earth (All time), or the other topics located on the first post.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

Can we some more posts, I feel this topic is getting lost.

[The Doctor, RIP Juggernaut]

Debate the top ten best gun.

My list and why.

10: M4-A1 Reason: fairly good gun used by more than one military kinda left hand friendly but in these days lacks the stopping power needed.

9: Bushmaster ACR Reason: It is a new type of platform able to change barrels and the round fired in a matter of seconds but cost to much to be used by military fielded by black water PMC.

8: H&K 418 Reason: Bigger build of a M4 firing the larger 6mm round but cost to much to be fielded in bulk USED by some US Spec-Ops

7: Grease gun  Reason: Simply the american AK-47 cheaply made at less than 100 USD But you didn't get a lot with it The safety was the cover for the ejection port and only fired on automatic and due to the round it fired (45 ACP) hard to control the recoil.

6: Vulcan Mini-Gun  Reason: Nothing shoots out pure fear like a mini-gun just the sound of it makes you run in fear. Firing the 7.62X51mm NATO OR the .50 cal BMG this weapon can rain down HELL on Tanks cars and helicopters over all a very good weapon good for striking fear on to people. But cannot be used by any thing besides a Humvee helicopter and tanks.

5: The Winchester rifle Reason: One of the best American made rifles of its time but due to it being lever action it wasn't a effective weapon system after the Spanish american war(As far as I know)
Copies and remakes are used in hunting.

4: Steyre AUG Reason: First bull-pup of in the world by putting all of the parts in the stock of the gun you can get a short gun a longer barrel and better shooting patterns. But due to it all being in the stock there is no buffer tube (Tube that holds a spring for the bolt to go back on) it has more recoil than most guns that fire that round(5.56).

3: H&K G36 series Reason: Over all with three version of it one of the best and should be here on this list.
The G36C used by any police forces and a few Armys around the world good in house to house warfare.
The G36k longer than the C and the carry handle can be replaced by one with a x3 red dot sight better for longer ranges.
All fire the 5.56 NATO.

2: Colt 1911 Reason: The only reason its being phased out is because of how heavy the ammo is just going to say that first.
One of the best pistol ever made firing the large .45 ACP round during a time when the army needed a larger round. After the Spanish-American war the US went to take down an uprising in one of the lands they gained during the war the natives where fighting so hard that the .22lr pistols weren't able to provide the stopping power needed so the army asked for some thing bigger.
Used by the US army many police forces for years from 1911 to 2008 when it was phased out of the army for the M9.

1: The AK-74 Reason: Better control than its older model the AK-47 with about the same stopping power.
The AK platform is the most reliable in the world hardly if ever jamming if even poorly kept used by the Russians and a few middle eastern nations the AK platform is one of the most widely used in the world.


You can debate the the weapons and make your own list.

[Journeyman H. [UK]]

The best gun debate really does not work, because each gun serves a different purpose.

The most progressive man (in theory) would have to be Leonardo Da Vinci, he's well ahead of his time, and worked on so many theories, and invention blue prints it's unbelievable, the only problem is that his theories were not put to the test, as people back then would not understand how his theories would work, and Italy was not a rich country, therefore his work was not put to the test.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I ?DetroitRP]

The best gun debate is meant just to talk about your fav gun. Try to choose, 1 sniper, 1 shotgun, 1 SMG, and 1 assualt rifle.
As for me, my fav gun is the MP5A2 Navy. The MP5A2 Navy is a better gun I beileve cause it was intended for th US Navy Seal, also used by SWAT (Most SWAT), SAS, and basiclly all Paramilitary and Military forces to date. Its all for one reason, accuracy. The gun is so accurate, and a lot of people say it is a puny gun because it uses 9mm ammo, there you would be wrong. FMJ 9mm ammo will still go through armour and the fact is that the mp5 has a extrondary large rate of fire. MP5 as been remodled and the G36 was made. The G36 is one of my fav assualt rifle. Heclor and Koch are the makers of these gun, they are German. Germans I feel are great engies. To Heclor and Koch, best gun makers in the world. Oh and btw, AK-74 does not have the same stopping power as its ak-47's counter part. The bullet is not very good at all, because at that time they made it, the Soviet's bullet for the gun did minimal damage as I remeber, it was thought that if they do sometihing to it, it would make it explosive. It was not true, but it is still a good gun though. Still not as good as the AK-47 and the RPK.

[YankeeSamurai]

In my opinion, forum debates such as this one are next to impossible for two main reasons.

Firstly: nobody has/ cites any reliable sources.
I can pull a lolfact out of my ass to prove a point, and with the right language skills I can make said lolfact sound as official as you please.

Another problem is that people aren't always respectful of opposing viewpoints. A few posts up, people were calling religous teachings "bullshit" and deeming those in top religous positions "pricks."

Nobody will gain any understanding with this kind of stuff happening, and the "debate" runs an unnecessarily high risk of turning into an emotionally-driven flame-war.

Right now, this "Serious Debate" doesn't seem to be more than simply arguing for the sake of arguing.